great find! the imago dei is such a crucial ground work for our stance toward the other...especially when there is such an easy justification for hatred.
Jesus loves Osama, but he also hates him. As the psalmist tells us all the time God abhors evil men - and there's no question this one is. Only in the devine mystery can hate and love coexist so perfectly - I don't get it.
but am i not an evil man too, swift? who defines what degree of sinfulness constitutes the "evil" label? just curious, and trying to start an argument. :)
What makes a man is not what he thinks he believes so much as what he really believes. What he really believes can be read from what he does. Yes, we're all imperfect, but not all sins are the same. As my priest Fr. Pat Reardon said recently - "Distraction during prayer is not just as sinful as murder". We're not all equally damned - "It will be better for Sodom and Gamorah..." But just a little damned is a pretty damn horrible fate so we cry out "Lord have mercy on me, a sinner".
ha... i wasn't exactly looking for an argument, just wanted to hear where you are coming from. while i hear what you're saying that there are differing degrees of sinfulness, who is it that determines at what point our sinfulness deems us an "evil" person? is this based upon the modern lens with which we view sin? for example, our grandparents generation and before would label homosexuality as such, while today i think we would think twice about placing it on a level any worse than adultery. so that's my first question: who decides which sins make for an evil man?
secondly, i'm no Biblical scholar, but i'm not completely settled with the notion of "God is Love" being able to hate. i'm more convince that the writer would have been using Semitic Hyperbole, a very common literary device used by the Hebrew people to make their point by exaggeration. (i.e. Jacob I have loved; Esau i have hated.) this can be found throughout the old testament (and even Jesus uses this when he calls us to hate our families out of love for him). From my understanding, this was common and any audience reading/hearing this at the time would have recognized it and known what the author was meaning. again, i'm open for conversation on this one as i'm no scholar...
Though I feel somewhat schooled ("no schola", Balem's ass), my main point is this: There are some people in whom the immage of God is so completely marred and deliberately forsaken that they are characterized by evil. Nero, Hitler, Osama. Why have we become so hip and relitivistic that we can't call them evil.
i hear you, swift... and don't feel schooled... i'm just regurgitating information that i don't completely understand myself... i'm comfortable with calling these men evil... but i'm also comfortable with calling myself evil, dead in sin, but regenerated through Christ.
and, swift, i'm glad you've brought another perspective to this conversation too... otherwise i wouldn't be processing this stuff right now. i'll continue to chew on this, as i'm just thinking out loud here...
9 comments:
great find! the imago dei is such a crucial ground work for our stance toward the other...especially when there is such an easy justification for hatred.
Maybe they mean Obama.
Jesus loves Osama, but he also hates him. As the psalmist tells us all the time God abhors evil men - and there's no question this one is. Only in the devine mystery can hate and love coexist so perfectly - I don't get it.
but am i not an evil man too, swift?
who defines what degree of sinfulness constitutes the "evil" label?
just curious, and trying to start an argument. :)
What makes a man is not what he thinks he believes so much as what he really believes. What he really believes can be read from what he does. Yes, we're all imperfect, but not all sins are the same. As my priest Fr. Pat Reardon said recently - "Distraction during prayer is not just as sinful as murder". We're not all equally damned - "It will be better for Sodom and Gamorah..."
But just a little damned is a pretty damn horrible fate so we cry out "Lord have mercy on me, a sinner".
Argument Aaron????
ha... i wasn't exactly looking for an argument, just wanted to hear where you are coming from. while i hear what you're saying that there are differing degrees of sinfulness, who is it that determines at what point our sinfulness deems us an "evil" person? is this based upon the modern lens with which we view sin? for example, our grandparents generation and before would label homosexuality as such, while today i think we would think twice about placing it on a level any worse than adultery. so that's my first question: who decides which sins make for an evil man?
secondly, i'm no Biblical scholar, but i'm not completely settled with the notion of "God is Love" being able to hate. i'm more convince that the writer would have been using Semitic Hyperbole, a very common literary device used by the Hebrew people to make their point by exaggeration. (i.e. Jacob I have loved; Esau i have hated.) this can be found throughout the old testament (and even Jesus uses this when he calls us to hate our families out of love for him). From my understanding, this was common and any audience reading/hearing this at the time would have recognized it and known what the author was meaning. again, i'm open for conversation on this one as i'm no scholar...
Though I feel somewhat schooled ("no schola", Balem's ass), my main point is this:
There are some people in whom the immage of God is so completely marred and deliberately forsaken that they are characterized by evil. Nero, Hitler, Osama. Why have we become so hip and relitivistic that we can't call them evil.
i hear you, swift... and don't feel schooled... i'm just regurgitating information that i don't completely understand myself...
i'm comfortable with calling these men evil... but i'm also comfortable with calling myself evil, dead in sin, but regenerated through Christ.
and, swift, i'm glad you've brought another perspective to this conversation too... otherwise i wouldn't be processing this stuff right now. i'll continue to chew on this, as i'm just thinking out loud here...
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